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nad e ali


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#21 sunnistudent

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 01:21 AM

(salam)

http://www.marifah.n...h...=2981&st=15

( post 29 to post 38)

#22 Abdulsalam

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Posted 10 February 2009 - 12:26 PM

(salam)
( post 29 to post 38)


(bis)
(salam)

Dear Mr. Sunni Student
Can you please post only one "post" in reply instead of such a long post?
its very difficult to find out the appropriate answer against the posted matter

fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

#23 Abdulsalam

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Posted 10 February 2009 - 12:52 PM

(bis)


(bis)
(salam)
Janab Tohidi bhai

Sab se pehlye apni ghalati qabool karon, main filhal Janab Shah Wali Ullah Muhaddith dehalvi, Shah Ismail or Shah Abdul Azeez ke
tasaneef or un ki zindagi barye main mughaltye ka shikar hon, jo ke waqt ke saath sath behtar ho jaygi.

Doosri baat ye ke agar main is waqt ghalati nahin kar raha to ye Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) Shah Abdul Azeez sahib ke walid majid hain?
agar han to baremeharbani tasdeeq karain... agar nahin to bhi tasdeeq ka intizar rahye ga....

Teesri baat janab " Waseela" se related aik article main ne post kia tha, kia aap us post(Aritcle) ko perhnye ki zehmat karengye?
agar ker len to behtar hoga. is ke baad yaqeenan kuch tashaffi ho jaye gi ke kon sa waseela jayez kon sa nahin.
Mullah Ali Qari (Hanafi) ka is Naad-e-Alliya ko Mozoaat-e-Kabeer main naqal karnye ki wajah bayan kar saktye hian aap?

Chothi or aakhri baat ye ka ab aap Shah Wali Ullah ka peecha chor dain kion ke woh to becharye Allah ko piyarye ho gaye or
un se un ke amaal se mutaliq sawlat Allah khud pooch lega. Jabke hum se humarye aamaal ka hisab hoga, ye nahin kaha
jayega ke tum kis aalim ko sahi mantye thye ya kis ko nahin, kis ka kia amal tha un tumhara is per yaqeen o amal tha ya nahin,
to jab hum se humraye aamaal ka hisab hoga to phir humye apny barye main fikar mand hona chahiyeye na ke guzar ja chukey
(Fout Shuda) afrad ke aamaal ke liye

Is ko aap Rah-e-Farar bhi keh saktye hain, kion ke muhye yaqeen hai ke is jawab ke baad aap ka sab se pehla radd-e-amal ya
hi hoga jab ke main samajhta hon ke agar koi sakhs dil ke bajaye damagh se sochye or meri tamam posts ka jayeza le to yaqeenan
ye samajh jayega ke aap khuah ma khuah Shah Wali Ullah ke peechye perye hoye hain or main aap ko apnye amal ke barye
main khabardar kar raha hon

In tamam baton ke baad, janab Toheedi bhai sahib aap merye bohat se sawalon ke jawabat gol kargaye....... ya ghalat baat hai.
zara Sofizm ke barye main, Hazrat Ali (ra) ke barye main, Naad-e-Alliya ka nazool ke barye main sawalat abhi tak tushna lab hain


fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

#24 Toheedi Bhai

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Posted 13 February 2009 - 06:53 PM

(bis)

Attached Images

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مسئلہ حاضر ناظر سمجھنے کےلئے


غزالی زماں علامہ سید احمد سعید کاظمی علیہ الرحمۃ


کی یہ لاجواب کتاب پڑھیں۔


[center]
http://www.mediafire...it10o181lsylm8k

#25 Abdulsalam

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Posted 13 February 2009 - 07:45 PM

(bis)


(bis)
(salam)

Janab Toheedi Bhai
Kahin aap ke kehnye ka ya matlab to nahin ke Mulla Ali Qari (RAH) ne jo is ko Mozooat-e-Kabeer main naqal kia hai us se sirf riwayat ghalat sabith hoti hai matan nahin??????????????

Kuch baat sajti nahin, na hi dil ko lagti hai............
riwayat agar ghalat hai to phir kahin or is ki koi sanad sahi hogi,,,, tabhi ye riwayat (Matan) is per amal sahi samjha jayega....?

fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

#26 Khalil Rana

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Posted 14 February 2009 - 05:43 AM

main ne to araz kiya hai keh humara istadlal rawyet se naheen , aap is ki snad tlaash ker lein , hum ne to yeh poocha hai keh aap ki jmaat shah wali ullah ko is ke vird ki ijazat le ker padhne ke baad mushrik kehti ya moohid ?

#27 Abdulsalam

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Posted 14 February 2009 - 10:22 AM

main ne to araz kiya hai keh humara istadlal rawyet se naheen , aap is ki snad tlaash ker lein , hum ne to yeh poocha hai keh aap ki jmaat shah wali ullah ko is ke vird ki ijazat le ker padhne ke baad mushrik kehti ya moohid ?

(bis)
(salam)
Janab Khalil Raana sahib
Bohat dino ke baad aap ke reply dekha, khushi mehsos hoi,

To janab sab se pehlye to aap/tamam barelvi bhai phir ya maan len ke ye riwayat is ka matan, sanad sab ghalat hain
yaqeenan in sab ke baad aap khud hi maan laingye ke is per amal karnye wala kon hai....

Jahan tak Shah Wali Ullah Muhaddith Dehalvi ki baat hai to janab jesa ke aap ko maaloom hai or hum per aiterazaat bhi hain ke hum apnye Ulama ki woh izzat nahin kartye jesa ke Deband Bhai, ye Barelvi bhai hazrat kartye hain, or is ki wajah bhi wazeh hai ke hum Quran-o-Hadith or in ke baad Qole Sahaba (ra) or phir in ke baad in sab se na takranye walye doosrye aqwall per amal pera, hain kisi Aalim ki baat per nahin or na hi bila tehqeeq pairvi (Follow) kertye hain.
Is ke ilawa hum agar kahin per Shah Wali Ullah Muhaddith Dehalvi ka hawala detye bhi hain to us jagha per jahan ke un ke mannye walye, un ko hujjat samajhtye hain (Itmam e Hujjat) warna jesa ke main ne kaha ke sirf hawale detye hain or un ki unhi batoon ko sahi mantye hain jo ke sahi hain...... tamam baatoon ko nahin.... kion ke hum ye bhi jantye hain ke insan se khata bhi ho sakti hai woh Ambiya (as) ya farishtye nahin hain lehaza ye bhi ho sakta hai ke ye ghalati ho jab tak ke unhe sahi rasta na mila ho (ye meri apni sooch hai), or jab Siraat-e-Mustaqeem mill gaya unhon ne isye chor diya hoga yaqeenan

lakin chonke kisi qisim ki kitab is silsilye main woh tasneef farma chuke thye or humarye un bhaion ne jo is se faieda uthana cahtye hain unhon ne is ko phelana shoroo kardiya (chahye woh un ke aziz-o-aqarib hi kion na hon).....
warna agar un ka maqsad naik hota to woh un ki un tasaneef, afkaar, aamal ka bhi zikr kartye jo Khalisatan Toheed per thye. lakin unhon ne ye nahin kia.
Isi liye humara masala ye hai ke hum kisi ki ghalati ko to pakar letye hain lakin us ki achaiyon(Good instinct) ko chor detye hai kion ke is se apnye maslak, khouahish, ifkar ka radd hota hai......

Wallah -o- aalam bissawab


fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

#28 Sybarite

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Posted 14 February 2009 - 04:31 PM

Tamaam posts parhne ke baad bara afsoos huwa ke itnay taweel arsay mei bhi AbdulSalam sahab chand seedhay se sawalo ka jawab dene se qasir rahay hain. Ye thread choo'ke bila'wjeh tool pakar chuki hai lihaza ab isay kisi conclusion ki taraf le janay ki koshish karta hon.

1. toheedi bhai ne Hazrat Shah Wali Ullah ki tasneef se Nad-e-Ali ko sabit kya. Agar aap ko iss zaman mein koi aiteraaz hai tu iss per saboot paish kijiye ke ye tasneef Shah Wali Ullah ki nahi, ya tu saboot paish kijiye ke unho iss se rujo'o kar liya.

2. toheedi bhai ye bhi sabit kar chukay ke Shah Wali Ullah ne Sheikh Abu Tahir Kurdi se Jawahir-e-Khamsa ki ijazat hasil ki. Tu matlab Shah Wali Ullah bhi Nad-e-Ali parha kartay thay. Agar aap ko iss per aiteraaz hai tu iss ke khilaaf saboot paish karein na ke qayaas'araaiyan

3. toheedi bhai ne tamaam shawahid paish karne ke baad kuch sawalaat kiye jin ka khulasa ye hai ke Nad-e-Ali ke wird ke baad Shah Wali Ullah Mowhid huway ya Mushrik?

a) agar Mowhid huway tu phir humien kyu Mushrik qaraar dya jata hai?
B) agar Mushrik huway tu phir Mushrik se Sanad-e-Hadith lenay walay, Mushrik ko Hujjat'ullah kehnay walay Mushrik kyu na huway? Aur agar Mushrik hain tu in ke khilaaf apnay kisi bhi mustanadd mufti ka fatwa paish karein.

Ab janab AbdulSalam sahab se guzarish hai ke agli kisi post se pehlay in seedhay se sawalo ka seedha sa jawab dein, baghair kisi siyaasi bayan'baazi ke. Ba'soorat-e-deegar aap ki posts baghair kisi warning ke delete kar di jaye gi. Aap ko bohut muhlat de di gai magar abhi tak aap sirf behs' baraye' behs hi kartay aye hain. So ab zara himmat kijiye aur faisla'kun andaaz mein jawab dijiye takay baat phir tareeqay se agay barhay.

Posted Image


#29 Abdulsalam

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Posted 16 February 2009 - 08:03 PM

TAb janab AbdulSalam sahab se guzarish hai ke agli kisi post se pehlay in seedhay se sawalo ka seedha sa jawab dein, baghair kisi siyaasi bayan'baazi ke. Ba'soorat-e-deegar aap ki posts baghair kisi warning ke delete kar di jaye gi. Aap ko bohut muhlat de di gai magar abhi tak aap sirf behs' baraye' behs hi kartay aye hain. So ab zara himmat kijiye aur faisla'kun andaaz mein jawab dijiye takay baat phir tareeqay se agay barhay.

(bis)
(salam)
Goya ye dhamki bhi hai ke agar main ne aap ke mouqaff ko qabool na kia to aap meri posts ko delete ker daingye
Jumlye main chupa pegham to yahi hai.......

Wesye mulahiza karain reply post

fi-aman:
Abdul Salam

#30 Sybarite

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Posted 16 February 2009 - 09:16 PM

Goya ye dhamki bhi hai ke agar main ne aap ke mouqaff ko qabool na kia to aap meri posts ko delete ker daingye
Jumlye main chupa pegham to yahi hai.......

Wesye mulahiza karain reply post


Aap ki naqis aqal isay dhamki samjhay ya tareeqay se baat karne ka zaabta, is per meri marzi tu chal nahi sakti. Beher' haal aap ko mouqiff qubool karne ki nahi balkay tareeqay se jawab dene ka kaha hai jo aap ab bhi nahi kar paye.

Aap ki reply post delete kar di gai hai kyu ke uss mein phir aap ne siyaasi bayan baazi hi ki thi. Jis tarah number waar sawal kiye hain ussi tareeqay se number waar jawab de dijiye, sirf unhi sawalo na ke poori taqreer.

Umeed hai iss baar thori ghairat karein gay aap.

Posted Image


#31 Abdulsalam

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Posted 17 February 2009 - 07:21 PM

Aap ki naqis aqal isay dhamki samjhay ya tareeqay se baat karne ka zaabta, is per meri marzi tu chal nahi sakti. Beher' haal aap ko mouqiff qubool karne ki nahi balkay tareeqay se jawab dene ka kaha hai jo aap ab bhi nahi kar paye.

(bis)
(salam)
Janab main ne messege main chupi dhamki ka zikr kia tha or aap ne us per amal bhi kar diya...........
is ka sirf aik matlab hai ke aap ke paas na to Nad-e-Alliya ki koi sanad hai na hi koi mustanid hawala.
lehaza jawab aap ke paas na humnye ki wajah se aap ne is ko delete kar diya hai

agar ghairat aap main hi to aap us pos ko un-delete kar dain takye logon ko pata chalye ke kia siyasi bayan bazi ki thi main ne...............



Aap ki reply post delete kar di gai hai kyu ke uss mein phir aap ne siyaasi bayan baazi hi ki thi. Jis tarah number waar sawal kiye


Ye to aap ka kehna hai ke "siyasi bayan bazi" zara awam ko bhi to pata chalye ke kia siyasi bayan bazi thi woh........?
hai himmat to logon ko dikhayen.

ab agar ye post delete ko gai to main ur is forum per mojood tamam log samajh jayengye ke aap ke paas ab koi hal nahin siwaye mujhye block karnye ke.......

fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

#32 Sybarite

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Posted 17 February 2009 - 11:51 PM

Janab main ne messege main chupi dhamki ka zikr kia tha or aap ne us per amal bhi kar diya...........
is ka sirf aik matlab hai ke aap ke paas na to Nad-e-Alliya ki koi sanad hai na hi koi mustanid hawala.
lehaza jawab aap ke paas na humnye ki wajah se aap ne is ko delete kar diya hai
agar ghairat aap main hi to aap us pos ko un-delete kar dain takye logon ko pata chalye ke kia siyasi bayan bazi ki thi main ne...............

Ye to aap ka kehna hai ke "siyasi bayan bazi" zara awam ko bhi to pata chalye ke kia siyasi bayan bazi thi woh........?
hai himmat to logon ko dikhayen.

ab agar ye post delete ko gai to main ur is forum per mojood tamam log samajh jayengye ke aap ke paas ab koi hal nahin siwaye mujhye block karnye ke.......


Mujhay iss waqt aap ki halat per hansi aa rahi hai! Matlab itnay bhi be'sharm huwa jaa sakta hai! Tuff hai aisay mazhab per.

Janab sawal ko aankhien khool kar parhiye kya hai. Aur aap ka roona chalta hi rahe ga iss liye aap ki post save kar rakhi hai mein ne. Aap jis andaaz mein seedha sa sawal kiya hai ussi andaaz mein jawab de dijiye phir aap ki post dobara add kar di jaye gi.

Sanad waghaira ki tu baat hi baad mein aye gi. Filhaal tu seedhay se sawal ka jawab dijiye.

Baqi ye himmat waghaira ke lateefay na hi choorein tu behtar hai. Himmat tu pooray forum ko aap ki nazar aa hi rahi hai ke chand seedhay se sawalo ka jawab aap se nahi dya jaa raha kyu ke aap ko maloom hai ke waha aap ki sari wahabiyatt aik jhatke mein beh jaye gi!

Masla dar'asal ye hai ke ab aap ki shay'ragg pakar li gai hai. Jawab aap se naa haan mein diya jaye ga aur na hi naa mein. Dono sooraton mein zalalat aap ka muqaddar tu ban hi chuki hai tu phir kisi aik raah ko chun kar aik hi baar poori tarah zaleel ho hi jaiye ab!

Mein aap ki asaani ke liye sawalaat ba'maa sample jawab quote kiye deta hun, takay iss baar aap ko siyaasi bayaan bazi ka mouqa na milay :rolleyes:

1. toheedi bhai ne Hazrat Shah Wali Ullah ki tasneef se Nad-e-Ali ko sabit kya. Agar aap ko iss zaman mein koi aiteraaz hai tu iss per saboot paish kijiye ke ye tasneef Shah Wali Ullah ki nahi, ya tu saboot paish kijiye ke unho iss se rujo'o kar liya.

Iss ke 3 hi jawabaat ho saktay hain.

a) Ya tu sabit kar dijiye ye tasneef Shah Wali Ullah ki nahi.

B) Ya tu sabit kar dijiye ke Shah Wali Ullah ne iss tasneef se rujo'o kar lya.

c) Ya tu tasleem kar lijiye ke ye Shah Wali Ullah ki hi tasneef hai aur mustanadd hai.


2. toheedi bhai ye bhi sabit kar chukay ke Shah Wali Ullah ne Sheikh Abu Tahir Kurdi se Jawahir-e-Khamsa ki ijazat hasil ki. Tu matlab Shah Wali Ullah bhi Nad-e-Ali parha kartay thay. Agar aap ko iss per aiteraaz hai tu iss ke khilaaf saboot paish karein na ke qayaas'araaiyan

Iss ke tu 2 hi jawabaat ho saktay hain

a) Ya tu sabit kijiye ke Shah Wali Ullah Nad-e-Ali nahi parha kartay thay.

B) Ya phir tasleem kijiye ke Shah Wali Ullah Nad-e-Ali parha karte thay


3. toheedi bhai ne tamaam shawahid paish karne ke baad kuch sawalaat kiye jin ka khulasa ye hai ke Nad-e-Ali ke wird ke baad Shah Wali Ullah Mowhid huway ya Mushrik?

a) agar Mowhid huway tu phir humien kyu Mushrik qaraar dya jata hai?
B) agar Mushrik huway tu phir Mushrik se Sanad-e-Hadith lenay walay, Mushrik ko Hujjat'ullah kehnay walay Mushrik kyu na huway? Aur agar Mushrik hain tu in ke khilaaf apnay kisi bhi mustanadd mufti ka fatwa paish karein.


Ye aap ke liye thora bhari sawal hai. Iss ke bhi mumkina jawabaat bata deta hun;

a) Ya tu sabit kar dijiye ke kis shariat ke hisaab se Shah Wali Ullah Nad-e-Ali parhne ke ba'wajoud bhi Mushrik nahi Mowhid hi thay.

B) Ya tu sabit kar dijiye ke Shah Wali Ullah Nad-e-Ali parhne ki wajeh se Mushrik huway aur iss zaman mein kisi bhi mustanadd ghair'muqallid muftay ka fatwa paish kar dein jo aap ki baat ki tasdeeq karta ho.

c) Ya phir be'sharam ho kar iqraar kar lijiye ke Shah Wali Ullah ke liye Shariat aur hai humaray liye aur. Hum Nad-e-Ali parhein tu Mushrik aur Shah Sahib parhein tu Mowhid.

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#33 Abdulsalam

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 07:38 PM

1. toheedi bhai ne Hazrat Shah Wali Ullah ki tasneef se Nad-e-Ali ko sabit kya. Agar aap ko iss zaman mein koi aiteraaz hai tu iss per saboot paish kijiye ke ye tasneef Shah Wali Ullah ki nahi, ya tu saboot paish kijiye ke unho iss se rujo'o kar liya.
2. toheedi bhai ye bhi sabit kar chukay ke Shah Wali Ullah ne Sheikh Abu Tahir Kurdi se Jawahir-e-Khamsa ki ijazat hasil ki. Tu matlab Shah Wali Ullah bhi Nad-e-Ali parha kartay thay. Agar aap ko iss per aiteraaz hai tu iss ke khilaaf saboot paish karein na ke qayaas'araaiyan
3. toheedi bhai ne tamaam shawahid paish karne ke baad kuch sawalaat kiye jin ka khulasa ye hai ke Nad-e-Ali ke wird ke baad Shah Wali Ullah Mowhid huway ya Mushrik?


(bis)
(salam)
Janab Sybarite sahib
Mulahiza karain Janab-e-Shah Wali Ullah ki janib se ghair Sharai ifkar-o-Aqwal se baraa't ka elaan

Shah_Wali_Ullah_Izhar_e_Barrat.JPG

Ab is ko bhi ghair mutaliq (Apni hat dharmi se) bata ker aap ne is ko bhi delete kar diya to phir baghair kuch aap ke kahye main ye samajh jaonga ke aap lajawab ho chukye hain, agar nahin to phir is post ko yahin rakh kar aap tamam logon ko is se mustafeed honye ka moqa dengye...

Ab is ke baad aap per ye bhi lazim hojata hai ke aap meri donon deleted posts ko "online" keryengye


fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

Edited by Abdulsalam, 05 March 2009 - 07:40 PM.


#34 Abdulsalam

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 10:32 PM


(bis)
(salam)
Janab sybarite sahib
Ab main yahan per woh apni donon psots jo aap ne delete ker di thin again post kar raha hon



Janab Sybarite sahib

Main ne bohat koshish ki ke aap shakhsiyat parasti se bahir aa kar Shariyat ke tehat apnye Nad-e-Alliya ko chor dain lakin……………………….

Main is ko mantaqi anjam tak ponhnchanye ko tayyar hon lakin ab kia kya jaye ke aap khud is ko tool denye ki koshish ker rahye hain.

Chalain aap ko aapke sawalat denye ki koshish karta hon “shayed ke terye dil main uter jaye meri baat”

Ab aap apni guzishta rawish barqarar rakhtye hoye muttafiq hotye hain ya nahin


To sab se pehlye number aata hai Shah Wali Ullah(RAH) ke radd ka, ke un ka naam leker kis kitab main kis aalim ne kia hai…. To janab Kitab ka naam hai Shariat-o-Tariqat, musannif hain Abdul Rahman Keelani

Jis main ke Sahawali Ullah ke aqeedon ka radd mojood hai.

Doosri taraf jab ke main ne kaha tha ke Toheed per Likhi har kitab or Shirk ke radd main likhi har kitab is ka radd hai to phir aap ka kehna ke “Humaraye nazarya ke mutabiq likhi Shirk ke radd hone ki sorrat main…” to janab agar humarye nazarya ke mutabiq ho tabhi to radd kehlayegi warna aap ke nazarya ke tehat to ye (Ma Fouq ul Asbab ke tehahat mangna) Shirk hi nahin. Aap ke nazdeek to shirk sirf Butoon ya ghair jandar se amngnya ya Ibadat karna per hi sirf Shirk kehlata warna or Shirk –e- Khafi main mubtla rahna koi mas-ala nahin. To phir baqool aap ke humarye ulama ka radd humarye hi nazarye ke mutabiq hoga na ke aap ke.


In se mansoob ghalat aqayed ka moamla to janab is ke liye tareekh ke hawalye mulahiza kernye ki zaroorat hai, to phir chaltye hain tareekh ki taraf

Mulahiza karain ILM-O-AMAL (Waqaya Abdul Qadir Khani) Vol 2 page 200 or 201.

Likhtye hain “Mir Qamar Uddin Manat Shah Abdul Aziz (Son of Shah Abdul Aziz) ke azeezon main se hain or yagana afaaq Janab Molvi Fakhar uddin Aurang Abadi Molad Dehalvi marqadan tab Sharah ke mureed hoye, or aik alam ke murshid ho gaye. Qamar Uddin Mannat ne kuch arsye baad Nawab Hasan Raza Khan or Haider Baig Khan ka taqarrub hasil kar liya, apnye aap ko Asna Ashri zahir kia or is rah (Madhab Ahl-e-Sunnat wa jamaat) se phir gaya. Haider Baig khan ki rafaqat main kalkata aaya or margaya”


Mulaiza karain Malfoozat-e-Azeeziya Page 92.

Likha hai ke “Mir Qamar Uddin Mannat Shah Abdul Aziz ke Mureed or Shagird thye”

Mulahiza karain Ajala Nafia, Page 3, Matboa 1348 Dehli.

Shah Abdul Aziz ne Usool-e-Hadith ki mash-hoor kitab Ajala Nafia in hi ke liye qalam-band farmaee.

Ab chonke aapke toheedi bhai apni post main zikr bhi kia tha ke Hazrat Shah Wali Ullah ke mansoob kuch kitabon ko dobara un ke azeezon ne chapwaya. Maqsad ye ke aap khulye dil se is riwayat ke matan per ghor karain to pata chalta hai ke ye riwayat fazelat-e-Ali (ra) main hai, chon ke Qamar-uddin mannat Shia ho gaye thye to ghalib imkan hai ke un logon main se kisi ne ye amal in se mansoob kar diya ho.

Aik jagha or jagha Professor Muhammad Ayub Qadri raqam taraz hain

“Jab ke haqeeqat ye hai ke Shiyat or Taffazalliyat ke selaab ko is dor(Era) main akabir-e-Mashayekh Naqshbandiya, Shah Wali Ullah, Hazrat Mirza Mazhar Janan, Hazrat Shah Ghulam Ali, Hazrat Qazi Sana Ullah Pani Pati ne bari paamardi se roka or in sab ke baad Shah Abdul Aziz ne” (Muqaddima Mazhabi Dastanyen or un ki Haqeeqat).

To janab ab aap ko samajh lena chahiye ke is amal ke ghalat mansoob honye ke ziyadah imkaanaat hain. Jahan tak aap ka kehna ke ye Hamarye(Ahl-e-Hadith)Ulama bhi mantye hain ke ye unki kitab hai to janab Usool-e-Hadith main hai ke (jab ke ye kisi Hadith ki darjye ke bhi barabar nahin) “agar ravi siqa ho lakin Mukhalifat-e-Quran, Mukhalifat-e-Hadith, Mukhalifat-e-Sahaba (ra) man riwayat kar raha ho to us ki riwayat nahin li jayegi

Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) sahib ke maslak ke silsilye mian aik or tehqeeq pesh-e-khidmat hai

Shah Sahb ne aakhri waqt main musalmanon ko jo wasiyat ki hai, us main bhi ye farmaya hai ke “masayel main un ulama ki pervi karain jo fiqh or hadith ke jamye hon or hamesha faqahi masayel ko Kitab-o-Sunnat per rakhain, jo kuch mowafiq ho usye qabool kar lain warna chor dain, ummat muslima ko kisi bhi waqt apnye mujtahidat ko kitab-e-sunnat per parakhnye se istigna nahin hai, or mutqashaf fuqaha jinhon ne kisi aalim ki taqleed ko dastawez bna kar sunnat ki talash-o-tatbaa’ ko chor rakha hai, ki taraf mutwajjah nah on or un se door reh kar Allah ka Qurb hasil karain (Atafhimaat-e-Ilahiya, Vol 2, Page 240)

Molana Abul Kalam Aazad ke walid farmatye thye ke “jab Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) ka intiqal hoa or Shah Abdul Azeez masnad-e-Dars per bethye to Mulana Fakhruddin (Mashoor Sofi Aalim, Nizam-ul Aqayed, Risal-e-Marjiya, Fakhrul Hasan or Risala Ayen-al-Yaqeen ke musanif), ne un ke sar per dastar-e-fazeelat bandhi thi, or jab pagri bandh chuke to kan main kaha ke tumharye walid sahib ke daman main aik dhabba lag gaya chukka hai, tumhara kam ye hai ke usye saaf kardo, Dhabba se maqsood shah sahib ka mujtahidana maslak or taqleed ke mazahib ka inkar tha (Tareekh-e-Mashayekh Chisht 234/5)

Ab fesla aap ke haath per hai

Jahan tak sanad ke pharnye ka masala hai, to janab agar bilfaraz man bhi lain ke ye un ka amal tha to kia aap batana pasand karengye ke Sanad-e-Hadith kisi nizam ke tehat milti hai ya phir kisi shakhs ki zaati raye per?

Yaqeenan nizam ke tehat, Is nizam ke tehat jo shakhs mayaar per poora utarta hai usi ko Sanad milti hai. Ab denye wala koi bhi ho sakta hai. (agar aap ki baat qabool kar li bhi jaye)

Ab aap dobara is riwayat ko dekhain, apnye amal ko dekhain, iski sanad ko dekhain or apni taqleed ko dekhain,

Is riwayat ki aap ke paas koi sanad nahin hail akin aap is per amal kar rahye hain, yaani ke Quran ki ayat ke mutabiq apnye Ulama ko Rabb bana rahye hain ke aik amal jis ki sanad nahin lakin us ko halal qarar deny eke bewajah koshish kar rahye hain kion ke aap ke ulama ne is par amal kia hai

Is ke ilawa ye kehna chahoon ga ke jab Hazrat Shah Wali Ullah ke is amal ke barye main shubhat-e-Sirkiya hain to in shubhat main parnye ka kiya fayeda?

Baat agar nagawar na guzrye to guzarish araz hai ke main ne aayena dikha diya hai lakin har koi khofzada hai jhoot ka chehra dekhnye se. lehaza koi amal sirf is waja se nahin karna chahiye ke is per aap ke ulama ka amal hai, un se ghalati bhi ho sakti hai, lehaza amal ki sanad dhoondhye, us ka makhaz maloom karain, tehqeeq karain, sirf taqleedan is per amal pera nah on

Faisal aap ke haath main hai, ab baraye meharbani Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) ka peecha chorain or apnye amal ko dekhain,

Ab main is behas (Hazrat Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) ki shakhsiyat) ko yahin khatam karta hon, lakin agar aap ki taraf se is per mazeed ya dobara sawalt pesh hoye to main jawab nahin donga (sorry for that)

Han agar Nad-e-Alliya ki koi sanad milye to zaroor discuss karain


Bhai sahib agar Roman Urdu ya Urdu main punctuation ke saath dobara likh daingye to kia qayamat aa jayegi, ya phir koi khas wajah hai na likhnye ki??


Jahan tak aapka sawal Qonoot-e-Witer main rokoo ke baad Qonoot or Hath utha ker dua mangny ke silsilye main hai to janab, Witr main rooko ke baad Dua-e-Qonoot ki koi marfoo hadith nahin hai, sab ki sab zaeef hain, han sirf hath utha kar Dua mangnye ke silsilye main Masnaf Abi Sheeba main kuch aasar miltye hain, jis ki bina per Dua-e-Qonoot main Kuch log haat uthatye hain,

Aap jis qonoot ki, jo ke Rokoo ke baad parhi jati hai, ki baat kar rahye hain usye Qonoot-e-Nazla kehtye hain (Yaqeenan aap ko bhi ilm hoga), or Sunnan Abu Dawood ki riwayat ke mutabiq Hazoor e Akram (saw) ne aik maheenye main panch namazon main Qonoot-e-Nazla parhi or Sahaba Ikram (ra) ne aap ke peechye Aameen kahi (Dawood, Babul Witer, Babul Qonoot fis-slat, Hakim, Zehbi or Khazeema ne sahi kaha hai

Bukhari-o-Muslim ke riwayat ke mutabiq Hazoor-e-Akram (saw) kisi baddua ya dua ki soorat main Aakhri rikat main Rokoo ke baad Ounchi awaz ke saath dua kartye,

Bukhari, Babu-tafseer, Hadith# 4559, 4560, 4598, 6200, 6393,

Muslim, Almasajid, Bab Istijab al Qonoot, fi Jamie-as-Salat, Hadith# 675


Nad-e-Alliya se aap ka aqqeda-e-Mushkil kushai hi to sabit ho ti hai, chalain aap hi bata dain ke agar main is Riwayat ko or Hazrat Ali (ra) ko mushkil kusha na manon to aap mujhye kia kahengye????

Pehlye is riwayat ko ghalat man lain phir doorsi riwayat ka number bhi aa jayega,

Ab doosri post bhi


2. toheedi bhai ye bhi sabit kar chukay ke Shah Wali Ullah ne Sheikh Abu Tahir Kurdi se Jawahir-e-Khamsa ki ijazat hasil ki. Tu matlab Shah Wali Ullah bhi Nad-e-Ali parha kartay thay. Agar aap ko iss per aiteraaz hai tu iss ke khilaaf saboot paish karein na ke qayaas'araaiyan


Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) sahib ke maslak ke silsilye mian aik or tehqeeq pesh-e-khidmat hai

Shah Sahb ne aakhri waqt main musalmanon ko jo wasiyat ki hai, us main bhi ye farmaya hai ke “masayel main un ulama ki pervi karain jo fiqh or hadith ke jamye hon or hamesha faqahi masayel ko Kitab-o-Sunnat per rakhain, jo kuch mowafiq ho usye qabool kar lain warna chor dain, ummat muslima ko kisi bhi waqt apnye mujtahidat ko kitab-e-sunnat per parakhnye se istigna nahin hai, or mutqashaf fuqaha jinhon ne kisi aalim ki taqleed ko dastawez bna kar sunnat ki talash-o-tatbaa’ ko chor rakha hai, ki taraf mutwajjah nah on or un se door reh kar Allah ka Qurb hasil karain (Atafhimaat-e-Ilahiya, Vol 2, Page 240)

Molana Abul Kalam Aazad ke walid farmatye thye ke “jab Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) ka intiqal hoa or Shah Abdul Azeez masnad-e-Dars per bethye to Mulana Fakhruddin (Mashoor Sofi Aalim, Nizam-ul Aqayed, Risal-e-Marjiya, Fakhrul Hasan or Risala Ayen-al-Yaqeen ke musanif), ne un ke sar per dastar-e-fazeelat bandhi thi, or jab pagri bandh chuke to kan main kaha ke tumharye walid sahib ke daman main aik dhabba lag gaya chukka hai, tumhara kam ye hai ke usye saaf kardo, Dhabba se maqsood shah sahib ka mujtahidana maslak or taqleed ke mazahib ka inkar tha (Tareekh-e-Mashayekh Chisht 234/5)


3. toheedi bhai ne tamaam shawahid paish karne ke baad kuch sawalaat kiye jin ka khulasa ye hai ke Nad-e-Ali ke wird ke baad Shah Wali Ullah Mowhid huway ya Mushrik?

To sab se pehlye number aata hai Shah Wali Ullah(RAH) ke radd ka, ke un ka naam leker kis kitab main kis aalim ne kia hai…. To janab Kitab ka naam hai Shariat-o-Tariqat, musannif hain Abdul Rahman Keelani Jis main ke Sahawali Ullah ke aqeedon ka radd mojood hai.

Doosri taraf jab ke main ne kaha tha ke Toheed per Likhi har kitab or Shirk ke radd main likhi har kitab is ka radd hai to phir aap ka kehna ke “Humaraye nazarya ke mutabiq likhi Shirk ke radd hone ki sorrat main…” to janab agar humarye nazarya ke mutabiq ho tabhi to radd kehlayegi warna aap ke nazarya ke tehat to ye (Ma Fouq ul Asbab ke tehahat mangna) Shirk hi nahin. Aap ke nazdeek to shirk sirf Butoon ya ghair jandar se amngnya ya Ibadat karna per hi sirf Shirk kehlata warna or Shirk –e- Khafi main mubtla rahna koi mas-ala nahin. To phir baqool aap ke humarye ulama ka radd humarye hi nazarye ke mutabiq hoga na ke aap ke.

Jahan tak sanad ke pharnye ka masala hai, to janab agar bilfaraz man bhi lain ke ye un ka amal tha to kia aap batana pasand karengye ke Sanad-e-Hadith kisi nizam ke tehat milti hai ya phir kisi shakhs ki zaati raye per?

Yaqeenan nizam ke tehat, Is nizam ke tehat jo shakhs mayaar per poora utarta hai usi ko Sanad milti hai. Ab denye wala koi bhi ho sakta hai. (agar aap ki baat qabool kar li bhi jaye)

Ab aap dobara is riwayat ko dekhain, apnye amal ko dekhain, iski sanad ko dekhain or apni taqleed ko dekhain,

Is riwayat ki aap ke paas koi sanad nahin hail akin aap is per amal kar rahye hain, yaani ke Quran ki ayat ke mutabiq apnye Ulama ko Rabb bana rahye hain ke aik amal jis ki sanad nahin lakin us ko halal qarar deny eke bewajah koshish kar rahye hain kion ke aap ke ulama ne is par amal kia hai

Is ke ilawa ye kehna chahoon ga ke jab Hazrat Shah Wali Ullah ke is amal ke barye main shubhat-e-Sirkiya hain to in shubhat main parnye ka kiya fayeda?

Baat agar nagawar na guzrye to guzarish araz hai ke main ne aayena dikha tha lakin yahan har koi khofzada hai jhoot ka chehra dekhnye se. lehaza koi amal sirf is waja se nahin karna chahiye ke is per aap ke ulama ka amal hai, un se ghalati bhi ho sakti hai, lehaza amal ki sanad dhoondhye, us ka makhaz maloom karain, tehqeeq karain, sirf taqleedan is per amal pera na hon.

Faisal aap ke haath main hai, ab baraye meharbani Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) ka peecha chorain or apnye amal ko dekhain,

Ab main is behas (Hazrat Shah Wali Ullah (RAH) ki shakhsiyat) ko yahin khatam karta hon, lakin agar aap ki taraf se is per mazeed ya dobara sawalt pesh hoye to main jawab nahin donga (sorry for that)


Han agar Nad-e-Alliya ki koi sanad milye to zaroor discuss karain


fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

Edited by Abdulsalam, 17 March 2009 - 10:35 PM.


#35 Toheedi Bhai

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Posted 02 April 2009 - 03:49 PM

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مسئلہ حاضر ناظر سمجھنے کےلئے


غزالی زماں علامہ سید احمد سعید کاظمی علیہ الرحمۃ


کی یہ لاجواب کتاب پڑھیں۔


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#36 Abdulsalam

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Posted 02 April 2009 - 07:41 PM

(bis)


(bis)
(salam)
Janab "Toheedi bhai" sahib

Ab aap wapis aagaye apnye khud sakhta fatwon ki janib, yani ke jab aap ne kaha ke "Shah Wali Ullah ka amal bhi yahi tha"
to mera jawab bohat details main tha ke un ka jo bhi aqeeda amal tha woh un ke saath ja(khatam) ho chuka.... , or aap ko or hum ko apny amal ko dekhna hai na ke un ke, kion ke Qayamat main sawal hum se humarye amaal ka hoga na ke unka...
lakin aap ne kaha ke nahin "humye un ke alfaz main is se inkar sabit kar ke dain" phir jab bohat siu koshishon ke baad aap ko un hi ki kitab se un ke "har" quran o hadith se takranye walye amaal ke khilaf baraat ka izhar pesh kia to aap kehtye hain ke nahin "khososan is amal se baraat ka izha dikhayen".....!!! aap ko chahiye tha ke "sirf reply post ke bajaye" pehlye apnye ulama se is masalaye ke barye main maloom kar laytye ke is "Elaan" ke baad kia fatwa lagaya jata hai?????
lakin problem to ye thi ke aap ka khud hi is per amal hai to aap kahan se manyengye... aisa amal Jis ke aap ke bhi nazdeek koi asar (riwayat) nahin milti aap taqleed main kartye rahna chahtye hain......(ISI KO TO KEHTYE HAIN ANDHI TAQLEED) warna daleel layen.....

Ab aap ko Aaima Arba ke Aqwal dekhata hon, Aima Arba (Abu Hanifa (RAH), MAlik (RAH), Shafai (RAH), Hambal (RAH)) ke kehna tha and hai ke "jo Qol humara Quran o Hadith se takra jaye us ko deewar per de maro" to kia is waqt bhi aap Un hi ki Zuban main is makhsoos hadith ka radd mangye gye?????

Bahia sahib (ab aap mujhye bhai mano ya na mano) Barahye Karam Andhi or Shakhsi Taqleed se bahir niklian or Quran o Hadith ko daton se Pakar lain, Allah tamam Hidayat denye wala hai

fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

#37 Toheedi Bhai

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Posted 03 April 2009 - 10:58 AM

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مسئلہ حاضر ناظر سمجھنے کےلئے


غزالی زماں علامہ سید احمد سعید کاظمی علیہ الرحمۃ


کی یہ لاجواب کتاب پڑھیں۔


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#38 Abdulsalam

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Posted 04 April 2009 - 05:09 PM

(bis)


(bis)
(salam)
Janab Toheedi sahib, Mere pas alhamdullilah is ka jawab hai lakin sab se pehlye aap se guzarish hai ke aap pehly woh hadith pesh karain (Sanand o Hawala jat ke saath) jis se aap Hazra Ali (ra) ka "Mola" yani madadgar hona istadlal kartye hain, wazeh rahye humye to lafz Mola (jo ke Allah ke liye khas mustamil hai) per bhi aitraz hai.

Ha agar aap nahin pesh kartye hain to phir mujhye thora time lagye ga mukhtalif jaghon se is ko yakja karnye ke liye.

fi-aman:
(salam)
Abdul Salam

#39 Toheedi Bhai

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 12:52 PM

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hazrat mola ali razi allah anho
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مسئلہ حاضر ناظر سمجھنے کےلئے


غزالی زماں علامہ سید احمد سعید کاظمی علیہ الرحمۃ


کی یہ لاجواب کتاب پڑھیں۔


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#40 Ya Mohammadah

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 01:47 PM

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