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اسلامی محفل

-Mazhar-

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Everything posted by -Mazhar-

  1. aap ne kaha ke thanvi sahb ne kaha ke ek do ulema ke siwa kisi na sheikh naotvi ka saath nahin dya, lekin main aap se poch raha hun ke tehzeer un naas likhne ke baad kin kin ulemaon ne sheikh nanotvi ko kaafir qaraar dya? mujhe is ka jawab dijiye aap.
  2. to bhai agar inkaar kya hai to maante kyun nahin ho aap? kabhi keh rahe ho ke unhon ne munazra e ajeeba mein achi baaten ki hen kabhi keh rahe to inkar kya hai, ek baat pe aao idhar udhar kyun bhatak rahe ho? saaf saaf kyun nahin kehte ke sheikh nanotvi ne inkaare khatm e nabuwwat kya hai aur RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) ko aakhri nabi maanne walon ko kharij ul islam kaha hai? yeh baat kyun nahin maante?
  3. aap ne kaha ke sheikh nanotvi sahb ne khatmiat e zamani kehne walon ko ehle islam nahin maana hai to phir aap yeh bhi maaniye ke sheikh nanotvi sahb ne khatmit e zamani ka inkaar kya hai. agar aap yeh nahin maante to aap khud confuse horahe hen. agar aap un ke inkar ko nahin maante to phit un ki baat ka matlab jo unhon ne tehzeer un naas mein kahi hai, kuch aur hai jo aap samajh rahe hen wo matlab nahin hai.
  4. aap ne kaha main ne shuru ke 3 point maan liye hen, jo ke aap ka jhoot hai, pichle 3 points ka jawab main ap ko suboot ke saath dechuka hun, aur saabit bhi karchuka hun. zidd ka koi hal nahin hai. baqi ke points ke jawab mein aap ne poora hawala nahin dya, poora hawala den taake poore context mein baat parhi ja sake. aap ne toba ki baat ki, to mere bhai, ap ko jis ibarat pe aetraaz tha, us ka jawab ap ko munazra e ajeebah mein mil to gaya hai jise aap ne bhi achi ibaraten mana hai, to aap ka aetraaz ab khatam hojana chahiye. wazahat milne ke baad bhi kyun bar bar ek baat duhraate ho? aur toba ki zaroorat to wahan hoti hai jahan koi galat baat ki ho, yahan to sheikh nanotvi ne is topic ka haq hi ada kardya hai, un ki aqal wahan tak gayi hai jahan tak kisi insaan ki na gayi thi. aur isi liye jab kuch kam aqal logon ko moqa mila sheikh nanotvi ko badnaam karne ka to unhon ne is se bharpoor faida uthaya lekin un ki yeh koshish bhi hamesha ki tarah nakaam hi rahi. ilzam aakhir ilzam hi raha jurm saabit nahin hosaka aaj tak. sheikh nanotvi sahb poore aalame islam mein apni khidmaton aur apne ilm ki waja se jaane jaate hen.
  5. sheikh nanotvi ne munzara e ajeebah mein khatmiat e zamani ko shaan maana hai is ka saaf matlab yeh hai ke jo baat wo tehzeer un naas mein kar rahe hen us ka matlab wo nahin hai jo ap samajh rahe hen, us ka matlab wohi hai jo munazra e ajeebah main likha gaya hai. tehzeer un naas ki ibarat ka matlab yeh hai ke ghaur se dekha jae to sirf yeh kehna ke RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) aakhri zamane mein aaye is mein RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) ki bizzaat kuch fazilat nahin, fazilat martabi mein hai jis ko khatmiat e martabi kaha gaya hai. alfaz "aakhri zamane" par hi saari tawajju hai. main phir keh raha hun ke alfaaz "aakhri zamane" pe hi tawajju hai. agar aap logon ke baat phir bhi samajh nahin aati to aap sirf un se ikhtilaf karsakte hen, kufr ka fatwa nahin laga sakte kyun ke nanotvi sahb munazra e ajeebah mein baat saaf karchuke hen, munazra e ajeebah parhne ke baad koi bhi sacha insaan un ko kafir nahin keh sakta aur na hi kaha hai. kitne ulema ne tehzeer un naas par fatwa lagaya tha? zara bataen to?
  6. aap ne mujhe abhi tak jawab nahin dya jo main ne post # 35 mein kya tha: Ab post # 40 mein jo attachment hai us ka jawab: point # 4, 5, 6 aur 7 ka saboot den phir baat karen. saboot den ke kahan RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) ki hadees ko matan bana kar awam ka khayal batlaya gaya? jab sheikh nanotvi ne khatmiat e zamani ko apna deen aur emaan keh dya hai to bas shaan saabit hogayi hai, aur jesa ke saabit hai ke unhon ne yeh baat tehzeer un naas ki taujeeh mein kahi hai, ab agar aap log bar bar, bar bar ek hi baat aur ek hi ibarat ko duhraate rahenge to yeh mehez zidd aur shaoor na hone ki daleel hai. main ne aap ko Munazra-e-Ajeebah ke hawale diye hen jo ke sheikh nanotvi ne tehzeer un naas ke aitrazaat pe likhi hai, lekin aap ne palat kar mujhe phir tehzeer un naas ka hawala dya aur apni baat pe are rahe. musannif ki khud ki taujeeh aur wazahat ke baad bhi us ki baat ko na maanna awwal darje ki bad-diyanati hai.
  7. hawala mujhe mil gaya hai hawala yeh hai: أنّه سَيَکُوْنُ فِيْ أُمَّتِيْ ثَلَاثُوْنَ کَذَّابُوْنَ، کُلُّهُمْ يَزْعُمُ أَنّه نَبِیٌّ وَ أَنَا خَاتَمُ النَّبِيِيْنَ لَا نَبِيَ بَعْدِيْ. (ترمذي، السنن، کتاب الفتن، باب : ماجاء لا تقوم الساعة حتی يخرج کذابون، 4 : 499، رقم : 2219) hawale mein kuch galati ho to mujhe bhi bataen.
  8. jis ko Allah Pak ki taufeeq hoti hai wo ek hi jawab mein samajh jata hai warna hazaar jawab mein bhi baat samajh nahin aati. Jawab mein main Munazra-e-Ajeebah se kuch pesh kar raha hun, ghaur se parhen:
  9. Munazra e Ajeeba mein aetaraz karne walon ke jawab hen aur us mein sheikh nanotvi sahb ne khatmiat e zamani ko apna deen aur emaan saabit kya hai goya ke us ko shaan maana hai
  10. shayyan e shaan jana hai, poori baat to parhen: شایان شان محمدی صلعم خاتمیت مرتبی ھے ghaur se samjhen to ap ko pata chalega ke khatmiat e zamani ka matlab yeh hai ke RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) tamaam nabion ke aakhir mein aaye, to sirf isi mein shaan nahin hai balke martabe mein bhi shaan hai. sheikh nanotvi ki ibarat mein hasar understood hai, kyun ke unhon ne khatmiat e zamani ko maana hai aur khatmiat e zamani ko apne deen aur emaan kaha hai,to is hisaab se un ki ibarat mein hasar hai. Jee han yeh jawab hai, ghaur se parhen aur toba karen. Allah Pak toba karne ki taufeeq de aap ko. sabot den ke sheikh nanotvi ne khatmiat e zamani ko kahan ghatya saabit kya hai? Hadees ka poora hawala den sunan abu dawood,tirmidhi wagera mein kis jaga kis safhe par aur hadees ka number. Saboot pesh Karen ke RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) ne kahan shaan se farmaya hai aur zikr kya hai,hawala den.
  11. aap ne phir se meri baat ko ghaur se nahin parha hai, barah e karam ghaur se parhen agar ibarat mein hasar nahin hai to lazim ata hai ke sheikh nanotvi sahb ne inkar e khatm e nabuwwat kya ho, (aur) agar inkar e khatm e nabuwwat nahin kya (aur beshak nahin kya) to hasar mana jaega.
  12. sheikh nanotvi ne khatmiat e zamani ko maante hue khatmiat e martabi ko afzal kaha hai aur us ki fazilat bayan ki hai, aur un ki nazar mein RasoolAllah(peace be upon him) ke khatim un nabiyyeen hone mein fazilat hai, yeh un ki tafseer hai. agar ap logon ko ikhtilaf hai to wo apni jaga, ikhtilaf to ulema mein aam hai lekin is ka matlab yeh nahin ke ulema e karam par kufr ka fatwa daagh dya jae aur un ki takfeer aur jhoot bandha jae. nanotvi sahb ne hargiz koi gustakhi nahin ki, jo aesa kahe wo jhoota hai. ap logon ne un ki ibarat ko tor maror ke pesh kya hai aur us ka galat matlab lya hai. yad rakhiye humein wohi manna hai jo musannif ki apni taujeeh hai, agar hum us ki taujeeh hata kar apna matlab hi pe arey rahen to yeh shairat ke khilaf amal hai. agar ap logon ko nanotvi sahb ki tafseer se ittefaq nahin to ap na maanen lekin kufr ke fatwe de kar kyun apni aakhirat bigar rahe hen. aur jo hadees ap ne pesh ki us ka hawala den. aur han sheikh qasim nanotvi ki kitab "Munzra e Ajeeba" parh len, kyun ke wo Tehzeer un Naas ki hi sharah hai. Aur us mein aetrazaat ke jawabat mojood hen.
  13. agar halka jana hota to khatmiat e martabi bayan na ki hoti aur tehzeer un naas jesi tasneef na ki hoti.
  14. Sheikh qasim nanotvi ne inkar e siffat to kya hi nahin hai. yeh un ka deen aur emaan hai ke RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) Allah Pak ke akhri nabi hen. to aap ki inkar e siffat wali baat galat hogai hai. sheikh nanotvi sahb ne kisi siffat ko halka nahin jana balke unhon ne tehzeer un naas likh ke RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) ke martabe ko buland kya hai aur bauhat gehrai mein utre hen jis ko samjhna har ek ke bas ki baat nahin. agar ap logon ko tehzeer un naas samajh nahin ayi to ap ka ikhtilaf apni jaga lekin kufr ka fatwa aur takfeer karna kisi soorat mein bhi ek ache aur sache musalman ka kaam nahin hosakta. ilzam aur tuhmat lagana asaan hai yeh hum bhi karsakte hen lekin is baat se Allah aur us ke rasool (peace be upon him) ne humen mana farmaya hai. main ne to nahin mana ke nanotvi sahb ki ibarat mein hasar nahin hai. aap ghaur se parhen main ne kaha kya hai aur phir jawab den, main ne kaha tha ke AGAR ibarat mein hasar nahin hai to lazim ata hai ke sheikh nanotvi sahb ne inkar e khatm e nabuwwat kya ho, agar inkar e khatm e nabuwwat nahin kya (aur beshak nahin kya) to hasar mana jaega. main ne hasar ko mana hai. barah e karam bat ko ghaur se parha karen aur phir jawab likha karen, apni marzi se jawab dena diyanat nahin hai. yeh masla alag nahin hai. khatmiat e martabi maanne se khatmiat e zamani laazim aati hai to yeh saabit hua ke jab sheikh nanotvi ne khatmiat e martabi ko shaan batlaya hai to zahir hai wo khamiat e zamani ko bhi maante hen aur khatmiat e zamani ka inkar hargiz nahin karte. aur yeh masla hargiz alag nahin hai isi topic ka hissa hai aur rahega, sirf is liye ke ap is se ittefaq karte hen to is masle ko alag keh rahe hen to yeh samajh len ke aesa nahin hai, main is masle ko alag nahin karta na karunga.
  15. agar ibarat mein hasar nahin hai to lazim ata hai ke sheikh nanotvi sahb ne inkar e khatm e nabuwwat kya ho, agar inkar e khatm e nabuwwat nahin kya (aur beshak nahin kya) to hasar mana jaega.
  16. ap ko kya hogaya hai jo bat pehle hai wo ap nahin parh rahe aur jo bad mein hai sirf wohi parh rahe hen. pehle likha hai ke: shaayaan e shaan RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) ki khatmiat e martabi mein hai. شایان شان محمدی صلعم خاتمیت مرتبی ھے
  17. ab mujhe yaqeen hai ke ap ko sheikh nanotvi sahb ki is ibarat ka jawab mil gaya hoga: agar nahin mila to is ka matlab saaf hai ke sheikh nanotvi sahb yahan khatmiat e zamani ki baat kar rahe hen yani agar awam sirf yeh samajhti hai ke ""RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) tamaam nabion ke baad sab se aakhir mein aye hen aur isi ka matlab "Khatim un Nabiyyeen" hai"" to aesa nahin hai kyun ke is mein Huzur Pak (peace be upon him) ki fazilat numayan nahin hoti jabke fazilat khatmiate e martabi mein numayan hoti hai. To Khatim un Nabiyyeen ke maane sirf aakhri mein aana nahin hai balke khatmiat e martabi bhi hai. Ummeed hai ab baat saaf hogayi hai.
  18. underline alfaz ghaur se parhen aur bar bar parhen: شایان شان محمدی صلعم خاتمیت مرتبی ھے، نہ زمانی۔ ص۱۱
  19. to main bhi jawab ke taur pe ap se sawal kar raha hun, ap barah-e-karam mujhe jawab deden ke aap ke nazdeek shiekh qasim nanotvi Nabi Pak (peace be upon him) ko aakhri nabi maante hen ya nahin? Phir InshaAllah baat ko aage barhaenge.
  20. to ap kya kehte hen ke shiekh qasim nanotvi Nabi Pak (peace be upon him) ko aakhri nabi maante hen ya nahin?
  21. to aap ke kehne ka maqsad yeh hai ke maulana sheikh qasim nanotvi apni is ibarat se khatm-e-nabuwwat ka inkar kar rahe hen aur yeh keh rahe hen ke RasoolAllah (peace be upon him) aakhri nabi nahin hen (nauzubillah)?
  22. Janab Saeedi sahb, barah e karam ibarat pesh karen aur apna tabsara den.
  23. mere khayal se yahan discussion nahin hosakti kyun ke yeh english ka section hai aur humen urdu mein baat karni hai, isi liye main ne "Barelviat" ke naam se naya thread banaya tha. Burhan sahb, ap plz uper ke post ko edit karlijiye kyun ke parhne mein dushwari horahi hai hurf alag alag horahe hen.
  24. Jis ibarat ko ap log kufrya kehte hen usay quote karen aur phir main InshaAllah jawab dunga.
  25. jin kufrya ibaraton ka zikr ap kar rahe hen, wo pesh karen. Barah e karam saari ibaraten ek saath post nahin kariyega taake main asaani se jawab de sakun. Dosri bat ye ke uper jo page ek bhai ne post kya hai, wo jis kitab se hai us ka reference dedijiye.
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